GUNS, DEBT AND CORRUPTION—Military spending and the EU crisis

SPECIAL REPORT: A look at how military spending also contributes to the social crisis throughout Europe.
By Frank Slijper

April 2013

Executive Summary

Five years into the financial and economic crisis in Europe, and there is still an elephant in Brussels that few are talking about. The elephant is the role of military spending in causing and perpetuating the economic crisis. As social infrastruc- ture is being slashed, spending on weapon systems is hardly being reduced. While pensions and wages have been cut, the arms industry continues to profit from new orders as well as outstanding debts. The shocking fact at a time of austerity is that EU military expenditure totalled €194 billion in 2010, equivalent to the annual deficits of Greece, Italy and Spain combined.

TNI-military-spending-01

DOWNLOAD FULL REPORT HERE (IN PDF)
______________

  • The debts caused by arms sales were often a result of corrupt deals between government officials but are being paid for by ordinary people facing savage cuts in social services. Investigations of an arms deal signed by Portugal in 2004 to buy two submarines for one billion euros, agreed by then-prime minister Manuel Barroso (now President of the EU Commission) have identified more than a dozen suspicious brokerage and consulting agreements that cost Portugal at least €34 million. Up to eight arms deals signed by the Greek government since the late 1990s are being investigated by judicial authorities for possible illegal bribes and kickbacks to state officials and politicians.
  • Military spending has been reduced as a result of the crisis in those countries most affected by the crisis, but most states still have military spending levels comparable to or higher than ten years ago. European countries rank 4th (UK), 5th (France), 9th (Germany) and 11th (Italy) in the list of major global military spenders. Even Italy, facing debts of €1.8 trillion, still spends a higher proportion of its GDP on military expenditure than the post-Cold War low of 1995.
    • The military spending cuts, where they have come, have almost entirely fallen on people – reductions in personnel, lower wages and pensions – rather than on arms purchases. The budget for arms purchases actually rose from €38.8 billion in 2006 to €42.9 billion in 2010 – up more than 10% – while personnel costs went down from €110.0 billion in 2006 to €98.7 billion in 2010, a 10% decrease that took largely place between 2008 and 2009.
    • While countries like Germany have insisted on the harshest cuts of social budgets by crisis countries to pay back debts, they have been much less supportive of cuts in military spending that would threaten arms sales. France and Germany have pressured the Greek government not to reduce defence spending. France is currently arranging a lease deal with Greece for two of Europe’s most expensive frigates; the surprising move is said to be largely “driven by political considerations, rather than an initiative of the armed forces”. In 2010 the Dutch government granted export licences worth €53 million to equip the Greek navy. As an aide to former Greek prime minister Papandreou noted: “No one is saying ‘Buy our warships or we won’t bail you out.’ But the clear implication is that they will be more supportive if we do”.
    • Continued high military spending has led to a boom in arms companies’ profits and an even more aggressive push of arms sales abroad ignoring human rights concerns. The hundred largest companies in the sector sold arms to the value of some €318 billion in 2011, 51% higher in real terms compared to 2002. Anticipating decreased demand at home, industry gets even more active political support in promoting arms sales abroad. In early 2013 French presi- dent François Hollande visited the United Arab Emirates to push them to buy the Rafale fighter aircraft. UK prime minister David Cameron visited the Emirates and Saudi Arabia in November 2012 to promote major arms sales packages. Spain hopes to win a highly controversial contract from Saudi Arabia for 250 Leopard 2 tanks, in which it is competing with Germany – the original builder of the tank.
    • Many research studies show that investment in the military is the least effective way to create jobs, regardless of the other costs of military spending. According to a University of Massachusetts study, defence spending per US$ one billion creates the fewest number of jobs, less than half of what it could generate if invested in education and public transport. At a time of desperate need for investment in job creation, supporting a bloated and wasteful military can not be justified given how many more jobs such money would create in areas such as health and public transport.Despite the clear evidence of the cost of high military spending, military leaders continue to push a distorted and preposterous notion that European Union’s defence cuts threaten the security of Europe’s nations. NATO’s secretary general, Anders Fogh Rasmussen “has used every occasion to cajole alliance members into investing and collaborat- ing more in defense.” Gen. Patrick de Rousiers, the French chairman of the EU Military Committee, at a hearing in the European Parliament, even suggested Europe’s future was at stake if military spending was not increased “What place can a Europe of 500 million inhabitants have if it doesn’t have credible capacity to ensure its security?,” he asked rhetorically.We believe by contrast, that at a time when the European Commission’s agenda of permanent austerity faces ever-grow- ing challenges, there is one area where Europe could do much more to impose austerity. And that is the arena of military spending and the arms industry. Abolishing nuclear weapons owned by France and the UK could save several billions of euros every year and fulfil a major pledge made by these countries under the nuclear non-proliferation treaty to finally eliminate nuclear weapons. Reductions of all EU nations’ military spending to Ireland’s levels (0.6% of GDP) would save many more billions. Writing off dirty debts caused by arms deals concluded through bribes, would be a good first step to lay the bill for the crisis with those who helped cause it. Such measures would also prove that at a time of crisis, Europe is prepared to invest in a future desired by its citizens rather than its warmongers.

     

    DOWNLOAD FULL REPORT HERE (IN PDF)

    https://www.greanvillepost.com/special/eu_milspending_crisis-execsumm.pdf




    The political fraud of the Pakistani elections

    Just  the latest “demonstration election,” for the benefit of a clueless public. 

    By Sampath Perera, wsws.org

    Women supporters of political and religious party Jamat-e-Islami chant slogans after boycotting the elections in Karachi

    Some sectors chose to boycott the elections, such as the religious party Jamat-e-Islami.

    Celebrations of today’s Pakistani elections to the National Assembly and four provincial assemblies are a political fraud, intended to lend a veneer of “democracy” to a neocolonial regime that is presiding over a society in a state of economic and political collapse.

    The elections take place as Pakistan sinks deeper into financial crisis and civil war, driven by the government’s support for the Obama administration’s escalation of the Afghan war into Pakistan. Since the beginning of April, over 100 people have been killed, including several election candidates, by forces allied with the Afghan Taliban who are resisting the US-led occupation of Afghanistan.

    The election will be overseen by hundreds of thousands of security personnel, including tens of thousands of army troops. In Punjab province alone, 300,000 security personnel, including 30,000 army troops, have been deployed.

    The votes cast by Pakistan’s workers and oppressed masses will have no influence on the key economic or military decisions affecting them. The basic framework of state policy has been agreed by the army and the political elites, on the instructions of the Obama administration and the International Monetary Fund (IMF).

    The current caretaker government has already negotiated the framework of a new International Monetary Fund emergency package of austerity measures.

    The media has rejoiced that the outgoing Pakistan People’s Party (PPP)-led government completed its five-year term, the first time a civilian government has served its full term in the history of a country ruled by US-backed military dictatorships for half of the period since formal independence in 1947. The PPP government survived, however, only by uniting with the army in imposing widely hated policies dictated by Washington. It left its security policy to the army and the Pentagon and implemented austerity policies formulated by the IMF.

    The PPP, the Pakistani bourgeoisie’s traditional “left” party of rule, not only continued military dictator Pervez Musharraf’s support for the 2001 US invasion of Afghanistan, but extended it into a war on its own people. The PPP and the Pakistani army have acquiesced to illegal CIA drone strikes that have terrorised large parts of the country and killed thousands, including unknown numbers of women and children. They have also sent troops into Pakistan’s tribal areas bordering Afghanistan to crush Taliban resistance, displacing millions of Pakistani civilians.

    The Pakistani ruling elite’s decades-long subservience to US imperialism, dating from the time the Pakistani state was established in the reactionary partition of the Indian subcontinent, has culminated in the re-imposition of new and toxic forms of colonial rule.

    In the 1980s, General Zia ul-Haq’s military dictatorship backed Washington’s policy of destabilising the Soviet Union by stoking a civil war against the Soviet-backed regime in Kabul. The CIA funnelled arms and money through Pakistan’s ISI military intelligence agency to sectarian Sunni Islamist groups, including the forerunners of Al Qaeda. This reactionary war was the political framework for Zia’s Islamicisation of Pakistan, which fuelled ethno-sectarian conflict and set the stage for an escalating US imperialist intervention into Central Asia that has now plunged Pakistan into violence.

    Karachi, Pakistan’s financial centre, is routinely ravaged by sectarian violence, prompting sections of the establishment to demand military deployment to make daily functioning possible.

    All sections of the Pakistani bourgeoisie are bankrupt. They are incapable of addressing the masses’ democratic demands and rely instead on communal discrimination to divide the working class and the poor. This was graphically exposed in the PPP’s bloody repression of separatist groups in impoverished Balochistan province, in which the regime terrorised the entire community. The PPP relied on the military to suppress the Balochi bourgeoisie’s reactionary attempts to partner with Washington as a pawn of US intrigue against Pakistan and Iran, with the US seeking to exploit Balochistan’s strategic location and rich resources.

    Whatever their tactical differences, Pakistan’s bourgeois parties—the PPP, the Pakistan Muslim League of industrialist Nawaz Sharif (PMLN), Imran Khan’s Tehreek-i-Insaf, and the Muttahida Qaumi Movement—are pro-imperialist parties relying on blood money paid by Washington to run the country. Whatever coalition of parties wins the election, it will continue to implement policies dictated by the Obama administration and international finance capital that have already devastated the country.

    Carrying out US and IMF demands for business-friendly policies for foreign investors, the PPP impoverished vast sections of the population, half of which was affected by food insecurity in 2011, an increase of 10 percentage points in two years. US bullying of Pakistan is also seen in Washington’s moves to cut off Pakistan’s access to neighbouring Iran’s oil and gas, resources that are needed to address Pakistan’s chronic energy shortages. Constant power cuts and load shedding have crippled the economy, affecting millions of jobs.

    Bourgeois rule in Pakistan has produced a historic failure. The outbreak of social and industrial struggles of the working class against power cuts and austerity has demonstrated the workers’ readiness to fight back. However, antiwar sentiment and opposition to economic plundering in the working class have been suppressed by the trade unions, abetted by Pakistani pseudo-left parties working in the orbit of the PPP and US imperialism. They reject the revolutionary role of the working class, cynically calling instead for “democratisation” and reform of Pakistani capitalism and the military.

    The struggle against US imperialism—which will seek to tighten its grip on Pakistan as it prepares, in line with its “pivot to Asia,” for war with neighbouring China—is the central issue in fighting for the Pakistani masses’ social and democratic aspirations.

    The struggle against US imperialism and its client bourgeoisie in Pakistan is bound up with the struggle for socialist revolution, led by the working class in alliance with all the toiling poor. The catastrophe that has resulted for Pakistani workers and poor can be fought only on the basis of Trotsky’s theory of permanent revolution. There is no faction of the bourgeoisie capable of or willing to carry through pressing democratic tasks in the economically backward, ex-colonial countries.

    The emergence of the working class in Pakistan as the leader of the oppressed masses in the struggle for socialism is bound up with the fight for the international unity of the working class—across the entire Indian subcontinent and worldwide, including the workers in the imperialist centres, who are overwhelmingly opposed to colonialism and war.

    Only the International Committee of the Fourth International advances this perspective. We urge Pakistani workers and youth to join the ICFI and build a Pakistani section as the new revolutionary leadership in the working class.

    Sampath Perera is a political observer with wsws.org, an information arm of the Social Equality Party. 




    Should the US bomb Syria?

    By Stephen Gowans, What’s Left

    syria-flag-aleppo-320

    There is no compelling evidence that the Syrian government has used chemical weapons against the rebel forces which seek its overthrow, and for purely military reasons, it’s highly unlikely that they have been used. Simply put, the Syrian army can kill more rebels with missiles, tanks and heavy artillery, even rifles, than with chemical agents. But even if chemical weapons have been used, a military intervention by the United States, its NATO allies, or its regional proxies, would fail the test of humanitarian intervention. First, it would exacerbate, not reduce, the suffering of Syrians. Second, it would be undertaken for concealed reasons of economic and geo-strategic gain, not to protect Syrians from chemical weapons, and neither for the promotion of multi-party representative democracy or to encourage tolerance of dissent.

    Three reasons the chemical weapons case against the Syrian government is weak at best

    1. Britain and Israel claim to have evidence that the Syrian army used chemical agents against armed rebels. The British evidence is based on tissue samples taken from armed rebels who claim to have been gassed by loyalist forces. To concretely make the case that the Syrian army used chemical weapons:

    • The tissue samples would have to test positive for chemical agents.
    • There could be no possibility the samples were tampered with.
    • A direct link between the contaminated tissue and an attack by Syrian forces would need to be established.

    Concerning the first point, we have nothing to rely on but the word of British authorities. Should we believe them? Britain has been implicated in attempts to concoct pretexts for military intervention with phony evidence before (see the bogus WMD claims used to justify the war on Iraq and the genocide fear-mongering pressed into service to justify NATO’s 1999 air war on Yugoslavia.)

    What’s more, Britain is hardly a neutral party to the conflict in Syria, and therefore has an interest in manufacturing justifications for more open and direct meddling. That’s not to say that the tissue sample didn’t test positive, only that it would be foolhardy to suppose that a country that “sexed up” evidence to justify a war on Iraq can be trusted.

    Secondly, “the samples collected by Britain may have been tainted by rebels who want to draw the West into the conflict on their side” [1], a point made by US officials.

    Third, “the detection of chemical agents doesn’t necessarily mean they were used in an attack by the Syrian” army. [2] Rebels, for example, may have been accidentally exposed to chemical agents they, themselves, had in their possession.

    The key point is that evidence of tissue contamination (if indeed such evidence exists) is not evidence that the Syrian army used chemical agents, since there are multiple possible ways in which the tissue could have become contaminated.

    2. Once US president Barack Obama declared that the use of chemical weapons by the Syrian government was a red line that would trigger a more muscular US intervention, the Syrian calculus turned decidedly against their use (and, as we’ll see in a moment, purely military considerations had already made their use highly unlikely.) Using chemical agents against rebels would play directly into Washington’s hands, giving the bellicose superpower a pretext to intervene militarily in an open and direct fashion. This would be a disadvantage that would grossly outweigh any advantage that accrued from the weapons’ use.

    Except for WWI, chemical weapons have rarely been used by any military, not because there are international agreements against their use, but because they’re largely ineffective. In fact, it could be said that many countries have agreed to forebear from using them, not out of horror over their effects, but because chemical weapons are largely useless in warfare.

    Political scientist John Mueller, who invented, with Karl Mueller, the idea of sanctions of mass destruction, has examined fear-mongering over chemical, biological and radiological weapons in his Atomic Obsession: Nuclear Alarmism from Hiroshima to Al-Qaeda (Oxford University Press, 2010). Mueller makes the point that chemical agents and toxins are rarely used in warfare because they’re ineffective. They kill fewer people than conventional weapons do, and their classification as weapons of mass destruction is purely political, having more to do with stoking fear of weak countries that have them than with their actual destructive power. [3]

    One of the drawbacks of chemical agents from a military point of view is that they’re easily countered. The intended targets need only don gas masks. And because soldiers in WWI were outfitted with protective gear, most of those who were gassed survived. A mere one percent of battle deaths were due to gas. By contrast, wounds from conventional weapons were 10 to 12 times more likely to be deadly. Gas made war uncomfortable, to no purpose, concluded the British, in their official history of WWI, which was why gas was retired from active use in WWII and after.

    The other problem with gas is that it’s messy and unpredictable. It can blow back on the attackers (true too of biological weapons.)

    And gas is terribly inefficient. A ton of sarin, delivered in the open, and under ideal weather conditions, would produce fewer casualties than conventional weapons. If the sun is out, and winds moderate, the destructive effects are reduced by up to 90 percent. In WWI it took an average of one ton of gas to produce a single casualty. Mueller correctly points out that chemical agents are so ineffective in killing large numbers of combatants that they can only be legitimately called weapons of mass destruction if pistols and machetes are too.

    So why would the Syrian military use an ineffective weapon, when it has access to conventional heavy weapons that are far more destructive, especially when use of the ineffective weapon would invite the United States to escalate its intervention? It makes no sense. On the other hand, once Obama announced his red line, it made a ton of sense for the rebels to falsely claim they were gassed.

    3. While an investigation by the United Nations independent commission of inquiry on Syria has found evidence that the rebels used sarin gas, no evidence has been found that the Syrian government has done the same. Commission member Carla del Ponte reported that, “We collected some witness testimony that made it appear that some chemical weapons were used, in particular, nerve gas. What appeared to our investigation was that was used by the opponents, by the rebels. We have no, no indication at all that the government, the authorities of the Syrian government, had used chemical weapons.” (Emphasis added.) [4]

    An intervention would create harm

    To reduce suffering, a military intervention would need to reduce harm to a greater degree than the military intervention itself would produce. No surgeon would cut off a leg to treat a fungal infection of the toe nails, and likewise no genuinely humanitarian intervention would create more suffering than it allays. Judging by previous US-led interventions undertaken for professedly humanitarian reasons, a military intervention in Syria would likely involve air strikes on Syrian military, government and even civilian facilities, with attendant civilian casualties, disruption of essential services, and massive displacement of non-combatants. According to The New York Times’ Elisabeth Bummiler, senior Pentagon officials have warned that “military intervention would be a daunting and protracted operation, requiring at least weeks of exclusively American airstrikes, with the potential for killing vast numbers of civilians.” (Emphasis added.) [5]

    To be sure, an open and direct military intervention would be ardently welcomed by Syrian rebels, and their co-sectarian arms suppliers, the Turks, Saudis and Qataris. But it would kill many and make life even more miserable and uncertain for Syrians, especially those living in areas under loyalist control.

    The civil war in Syria is estimated to have led to the deaths of 70,000 people so far, but US intervention in Iraq in the form of sanctions killed at least 10 times that number, while the US military intervention in the country led to the deaths of hundreds of thousands. A direct US military intervention in Syria would considerably add to the toll of dead in the Syrian conflict.

    Far better to reach a political solution. But one of the reasons the Syrian civil war carries on is because the United States refuses to back a political resolution that would fall short of achieving its chief Syria foreign policy goal, namely, the ouster of Assad and his replacement by a pliant, pro-US government. A genuinely humanitarian intervention would set as its goal an end to hostilities, not the absorption of Syria into the US-Israeli camp.

    Intervention wouldn’t be based on humanitarian concern

    There is no reason to believe that the United States has any genuine interest in protecting Syrians from chemical weapons attacks. Washington dismissed out of hand evidence presented by the United Nations that the rebels used sarin gas, which is hardly what a government would do were it genuinely keen on protecting all Syrians from chemical attack, no matter which side of the conflict they’re on.

    Significantly, US regime change policy in Syria antedates Syria’s civil war. The outbreak of the “Arab Spring” in Syria, and Damascus’s response to it, didn’t start the ball rolling on US efforts to force Assad from power. US regime change policy, linked to Damascus’s refusal to become a “peace-partner” with Israel, its alliance with Iran and Hezbollah, and its refusal to fully open its economy to US capital, existed long before the Syrian government cracked down on opposition forces. In fact, one element of US foreign policy was to encourage opposition to the Assad government, [6] that is, to foment the kind of civil unrest that eventually morphed into a full blown civil war.

    Multi-party representative democracy, a tolerant attitude to dissent, and eschewal of chemical weapons, have not been relevant components of US foreign policy decision making. They have instead served as stalking horses behind which lurk the commercial and financial interests of Western banks, investors and corporations.

    Indeed, Washington has shown itself willing to overlook the absence of multi-party representative democracy, to ignore an intolerant attitude to dissent, and to turn a blind eye to the deployment of chemical weapons, where US corporate interests are promoted, either directly, or indirectly through the strengthening of United States’ geostrategic position. For example, Washington and its NATO allies have adopted a tolerant attitude to the violent suppression (aided by Saudi tanks) of a Shiite rebellion in Bahrain against an absolutist Sunni monarchy, while at the same time casually dismissing the UN’s concrete suspicions that the Syrian rebels used sarin gas. Significantly, Bahrain, a paragon of free-market, free-enterprise, exploitation, is home to the US Fifth Fleet; Saudi Arabia is a source of generous profits for US oil majors and New York investment banks; and the Syrian rebels are instruments through which US foreign policy goals of regime change in Damascus are to be achieved. If US foreign policy was indeed driven by democracy-promotion, human rights objectives, and non-proliferation goals, its attitude toward Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the UAE, Jordan and the possibility of sarin gas use by Syrian rebels, would be very different.

    Conclusion

    Chemical weapons are largely ineffective in warfare, which is why, since their failure in WWI to be anything more than uncomfortably inconvenient, they’ve rarely been used. There are sound military reasons, then, why the Syrian army wouldn’t use chemical agents against armed rebels. Loyalist forces can kill far more rebels with missiles, tanks and heavy artillery.

    There are also sound strategic reasons for the Syrian army to leave chemical weapons in storage. Deploying these weapons would play into Washington’s hands by providing the United States with a pretext to escalate its intervention in the Syrian civil war. It is unreasonable to think that the Syrian military would blunder into the dual error of using ineffective weapons, when more effective weapons are readily available, and when doing so would hand Washington a pretext to directly intervene militarily on the rebels’ side.

    On the other hand, any force that would benefit from a more muscular US intervention on the rebels’ behalf has an interest in manufacturing evidence of the use of chemical agents by Syrian forces. This would include the rebels themselves and those of the United States’ allies that would like Washington to refashion Syria in their political or sectarian interests.

    Much as intervention by the United States is sold as a humanitarian exercise, it fails the humanitarian test on two levels. First, it would create substantial harm. US military officials have warned that direct military intervention—which would take the form of US air strikes—would create massive civilian casualties. Second, US foreign policy is based on commercial, financial, and geo-strategic goals, not the promotion of multi-party representative democracy, tolerance of dissent, and anti-proliferation. This is clear from a simple examination of the countries Washington supports (satellites who are friendly to US economic and military interests, regardless of their political structure, human rights record and attitudes to WMD) and countries it opposes (countries whose economic and military policies are geared to internal interests, regardless of their political structure, human rights record and attitudes to WMD.)

    In other words, a country’s attitude to US free enterprise and its willingness to submit to US domination are reliable predictors of whether the United States will treat it as an ally, not whether it practices multiparty representative democracy, tolerates dissent and eschews weapons of mass destruction.

    For all these reasons the United States should not bomb Syria, and nor should it provide military, diplomatic, or any other kind of assistance to the Syrian rebels. Of course, what it should do and what it will do are very different matters, but all the same we should be clear that the chemical weapons case against Syria is a fraud, as is the idea that direct US military intervention in the Syrian conflict would have either a humanitarian basis or humanitarian outcome.

    1. Adam Entous, Joshua Mitnick and Stephen Fidler, “Syria used chemical arms, Israel says”, The Wall Street Journal, April 23, 2013.

    2. Ibid.

    3. Fear over North Korea’s atomic bombs is similarly exaggerated. The devices the country has tested have been in the one kiloton range, one-tenth the yield of the bomb the United States dropped on Hiroshima in 1945. A one kiloton bomb set off at the center of New York’s Central Park would fail to destroy the surrounding buildings. Even if North Korea had the know-how to miniaturize a bomb to fit it atop a ballistic missile (which it likely does not), and then reliably deliver the warhead to a US target (which it hasn’t the capability to do), the damage would hardly bring the United States to its knees. The damage to North Korea in retaliatory US strikes would, however, be on an entirely different scale.

    Approximately 100,000 Japanese died as a result of the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, many burning to death because the cities were largely made from wood, which provided fuel for massive conflagrations. The death toll, had the cities be made from concrete, steel and glass, as modern cities are, would have been lower. Far more Iraqis died as a result of sanctions, and who knows how many Iranians and North Koreans have died because US sanctions are undermining their countries’ health care systems. Indeed, Mueller points out that sanctions intended to prevent countries from acquiring nuclear weapons have been the “cause of far more deaths than have been inflicted by all nuclear detonations in all of history.” Sanctions, more than atomic bombs, and even more than chemical and biological agents, truly deserve the appellation “weapons of mass destruction.”

    4. Alex Lantier, “UN says US-backed opposition, not Syrian regime, used poison gas”, World Socialist Web Site, May 7, 2013

    5. Elisabeth Bummiler, “Military points to risks of Syrian intervention”, The New York Times, March 11, 2012.

    6. Craig Whitlock, “U.S. secretly backed Syrian opposition groups, cables released by Wikileaks show”, The Washington Post, April 17, 2011.




    Debating Bill Maher on Muslims, Islam and US foreign policy

    The HBO host has become a leading advocate of the view that Islam is uniquely violent and threatening. Does that hold up under critical scrutiny?

    By guardian.co.uk, Saturday 11 May 2013

      • Bill Maher Show

        From l to r: Glenn Greenwald, Joy Reid, Charles Cooke, Bill Maher on HBO’s “Real Time”, May 11, 2013 Photograph: screen grab

    Last night I was on Bill Maher’s HBO show “Real Time”. There have always been numerous views of Maher’s with which I agree. But he has become one of the most vocal and extreme advocates of the view that – while religion generally should be criticized – Islam is a uniquelythreatening and destructive force and that Muslims are uniquely oppressive and violent, and that mentality has infected many of his policy views (see here and here for some comprehensive background; just two weeks ago, he had a fairly typical outburst on this topic). When I was scheduled to do the show, I was hoping that the opportunity would arise to debate these views (or that I could create the opportunity), and last night it did.

    The resulting exchange, which was somewhat contentious and sustained for a show like this, can be seen on the recorder below. The segment begins at the 4:45 mark and our specific exchange begins a couple of minutes after that (the first segment on this video is a debate on whether Benghazi is now a “scandal” in light of newly released documents). Our exchange ends up, I believe, capturing the crux of this debate – which is essentially similar to the one I had recently with Sam Harris and friends – rather well:




    Greenwald vs. Maher on the ‘Unique’ Nastiness of Muslims (VIDEO}

    by Alexander Reed KellyTRUTHDIG

    Greenwald: Hard to rectify a thousand misconceptions in a few interruption-filled minutes.

    Greenwald: Hard to rectify a thousand misconceptions in a few interruption-filled minutes.

    Friday night on Bill Maher’s “Real Time,” Guardian columnist and former civil rights litigator Glenn Greenwald attacked the view that Islam is a “uniquely” threatening force in the world and that Muslims should be deprived of the benefits of the classical liberal values that many groups in the West have struggled to make into policy since the 18th-century Enlightenment.

    That view has “infected” many of Maher’s “policy views,” Greenwald wrote on The Guardian on Saturday morning. On the show, Maher said the United States is not responsible for the prevalence of dictatorships throughout the Middle East.

    Greenwald responded: “We were supporting and propping up Mubarak for 30 years. Even as we were cheering for all the Tahrir Square demonstrators as if we were on their side, it was our government that kept Mubarak in power, just like we’ve done across the entire Muslim world. And it’s amazing for you to say that, ‘Look at all these Muslims. The minute you give them a little freedom they go wild and they start being all violent.’ How can you be a citizen of the United States, the country that has generated more violence and militarism in the world over the last five or six decades and say, ‘Look at those people over there. They are incredibly violent.’ ”

    Greenwald correctly says his exchange with Maher, which starts at the 4:45 mark below, captures the crux of this debate.

    BestViews4Life: